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Archiver > Scotch-Irish > 2011-04 > 1301951898

From: "Virginia Beck" <>
Subject: Re: [S-I] Hanoverians,British-German Royal Family of Windsor (Hanover)-Mountbatten
Date: Mon, 4 Apr 2011 14:18:18 -0700
References: <><FD47A65BA50D4B6E9BF5AD1B11C59003@SarahPC>
In-Reply-To: <FD47A65BA50D4B6E9BF5AD1B11C59003@SarahPC>

I have a York line but, of the information I started with, only my maternal
gg-grandparent's names proved to be accurate, and I haven't succeeded in
tracing either family much farther.

My maternal gg-grandmother was Hester York, b. 1826 in New York, d. 1903 in
Wisconsin. She married William Johnson in 1845 in Lima, Rock County,
Wisconsin. He was killed during the Civil War on May 10, 1864 at Laurel
Hill, Battle of Spotsylvania Courthouse, Virginia.
Hester's mother was Lucy O. York (I discovered Lucy in a notarized statement
she made to prove her daughters right to a widow's pension - Nat'l
Archives). Lucy may have been the wife of a Miletus York or someone closely
related to him (and there is more than one Miletus York). I have found a
tantalizing amount of information indicating that a Miletus had close ties
with my family, but so far no documentation to prove a relationship. I'm
still digging!

-----Original Message-----
[mailto:] On Behalf Of Sarah
Sent: Monday, April 04, 2011 1:03 PM
Subject: Re: [S-I] Hanoverians, British-German Royal Family of Windsor



we were told this is a smaller group but did match my "cousin " in Northern
One that has always insterested me is the YORK line of my
husband........from England of course. But where?? in Yorksheire I would
suppose but so far this is unknown.
Anyone on the lish have a YORK line???

----- Original Message -----
From: <>
To: <>
Sent: Monday, April 04, 2011 11:26 AM
Subject: Re: [S-I] Hanoverians, British-German Royal Family of Windsor

> Hi Steade,
> Do you understand the origin of the ethnic group called the Scotch Irish?
> There is a book that explains it. However I can't transcribe it here
> <grin>.
> Suffice it to say, basing my comments on the scholarship of the
> Scotch-Irish Society, that the term only pertains to Americans. The term
> is NOT used in Ulster (except as marketing ploys aimed at Americans). So
> unless the royal family has American roots, there is no chance of their
> having 'Scotch Irish' roots.
> If you are actually wondering if they got any roots in Ulster, that is an
> entirely different question. The Ulster Scots, as an ethnic group, didn't
> exist before the early 1600s, so you don't have to go too far back to
> research that. The genealogy of the royal family goes back WAY farther
> than that. Who were the Scots/Welsh/Germans/English/Dutch (etc, etc) who
> migrated to Ulster? Well, largely they were certainly not royality. The
> Scots were largely lowland Scots -- what our dear Ed calls "Third spearmen

> from the left". Royalty don't emigrate to far off countries full of
> hostile natives with few castles. They stick close to home where they can
> cash in on their royal heritage when someone croaks. (This is a generality

> that like all generalities, has exceptions). I learned this in a genealogy

> class but haven't actually researched enough American families to prove
> it. So far though, I've not found any descended from royality. Ulster was
> the earlier, closer alternative to North A!
> merica. Same kinds of people were attracted to it. The exception is that a

> number of colonial families have DNA that is traceable to reknown O'Neill
> lineages. So the hills of Tennessee, for one, are full of Irish princes.
> The Irish were of course already there. I seem to recall that there are
> Irish ancestors in the Royal Line. There certainly is Scots through the
> Queen Mother, but not the third spearman kind of Scots!
> However the genealogy of the royals is well researched so there's no
> reason for you to wonder when you can learn. Google and you'll find some
> sites. Kate Middleton's genealogy is also now being done. I heard
> something about this recently. The average degree of relatedness (they
> say) in England is 7th cousin. However she is a 14th cousin to William
> through one line that was gentry. She is also apparently related to
> several American presidents. I'm sure we'll hear more.
> Professional genealogists at the New England Historical Society have
> published a book on Kate's ancestry:
> video of interview here:
> If you purchase and read the book you can become the list's expert on Kate

> Middleton genealogy <grin>!
> However I am not so sure that the Royals would welcome the thought that
> they might descend from peasant lowland Scottish farmers. Cough! There
> were of course the planters who came, but they rapidly assimilated into
> the upper classes and ceased to be ethnically "Ulster Scot". In order to
> retain their land they had to conform to the Established Church.
> Agnew's book on Belfast Merchants details the assimilation of Belfast
> merchants, confronted with the choice of conforming or losing their
> political and social advantages.
> You can no doubt find lists with a google that are focused on the ancestry

> of the Royals. They would definitely both have more information and more
> interest than ourselves here. We're not terribly interested at all. They
> don't help us do our genealogy -- which is what this list is about.
> The European royality, over the centuries, inbred constantly with one
> another. The royality of say Greece (Prince William) had more in common,
> genetically, with the Russian Royal family that with the Greeks. Etc, etc.

> All you have to do to learn about it in modern times is read a bio of
> Queen Victoria and note who her children married. This was studied because

> of the hemophiliac gene besides fascination with the Royals. But if you go

> back a thousand years or even more you'll find all those families already
> intermarrying. And not with us. Though via the bar sinister I am sure a
> few of us are related to the Royals. A few of those lines became prominent

> gentle families too. The descendants of many blow-bys may have drifted to
> Ulster, but you'll need a lot of DNA to prove it. And not just your own.
> They are not always willing to participate in DNA testing with the riff
> raff.
> Thanks for asking -- I am thrilled to see this book has been published and

> will view the video if I don't get struck dead by lightning on the daily
> dogwalk. Which might need canceled....looking mighty dark out there!
> Queen Elizabeth I did use the term "Scotch Irish", we're told (I'm not
> quite old enough to have heard her...). She usually surrounded it with a
> few choice words that we indicate with $$!!##@!!. And she wasn't referring

> to our ancestors. She was cursing out the highland Scots who formed the
> McDonald army who invaded Ulster in the mid 1500s. King James had given
> the old McDonald lands to the Campbells -- so they reactivated an old
> claim based on a medieval marriage to Ulster. (Details in Hanna "The
> Scotch-Irish") They were Catholic Gaelic speaking dudes who would have
> removed your head for suggesting they were descended from either
> lowlanders or farmers. Given a choice later on of self identifying as
> "Irish" (Catholic natives) and "Ulster Scots" (Protestant invaders), some
> went one way and some the other. They continue to live in the Glenns of
> Antrim. Apparently my maternal-paternal ancestors (Andersons from Antrim)
> were McDonald men. Unlike my grandfather, I do not have red h!
> air, but I did inherit the very bad temper. If I had a sword, I'd have
> removed a few heads myself, but the angels or fairies arranged that I
> would not have a sword and so many lives were spared.
> My grandfather was very 'Scotch Irish". He was still eating corn pone in
> his 80s (not something you did in Ulster, btw: his ancestors learned it
> from the Indians). According to my mother, a depression era childhood with

> him was horrible. But she complained when she had to eat mangos that
> relatives shipped up from Florida. She was under-spanked, in my opinion.
> However she didn't enjoy Thanksgiving. That's when her father went out on
> the back porch and shot something. What he shot, you ate. One year possum.

> Though every time I tell this story someone tries to convince me it's
> wonderful. Sorry, but my mother didn't like it and I don't eat dead
> animals at all, being vegetarian.
> Grandpa might have been related to the Plantagenets via and unproven
> genealogy that links his Culmers to the Bourchiers in 1500. The Culmers he

> tried to pass off as Scots but it took very little work on my mother's
> part to decloak them as English from Kent. Alas, no one told my
> grandfather that the Revolution was over so he still hated English. He
> probably is related somehow to Blue Dick Culmer, an extreme Puritan
> minister who was locked out of his church by his parishioners. He was
> possibly the world's worse sermonizer so they promised to pay his salary
> if he just went away and never preached. He personally broke the stained
> glass in Canterbury Cathedral on order of Parliament. The locals rioted
> and tried to break a few of his bones. You know you got family lineage
> problems when you discover a dog-eared copy of an old English Divine among

> your great grandma's belongings. He tried to hide it but truth won out.
> Li nda Merle
> ----- Original Message -----
> From:
> To:
> Sent: Monday, April 4, 2011 11:31:25 AM
> Subject: [S-I] Hanoverians, British-German Royal Family of Windsor
> (Hanover)-Mountbatten
> In a message dated 4/4/2011 1:50:47 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
> writes:
> Most of the interpretation of history in the first paragraph is
> inaccurate.
> The accession of the Hanoverians to the throne resulted in Prime
> Ministerial
> / Cabinet government which we still have. It was not German Rule. This is
> a
> total misconception.
> Edward
> Edward,
> Thank you for your response. You are correct. The blood line of the
> British royal family is now distinct from governance of the country. The
> House
> of Hanover brought a very interesting bloodline to the British royal
> family and throne.
> Prince Philip Mountbatten (formally Battenberg, his mother's surname), the
> father of Prince Charles, is of more German heritage than English.
> I wonder how much S-I heritage the British royal has.
> Steade
> Hanoverians, British-German Royal Family of Windsor-Mountbatten
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