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Archiver > Scotch-Irish > 2001-07 > 0996278802


From: Charles Clark <>
Subject: Re: [Scotch-Irish] Coat-of-Arms
Date: Sat, 28 Jul 2001 12:06:42 +1200
References: <da.9a6daba.2892db99@aol.com>


The problem is that this is two parts hogwash and one part delusions of grandeur,
and says more about attitudes to the law than it does about the coats of arms
themselves.
The trick is, of course, to show that you can consider yourself to be above the
law by getting away with the use of a coat of arms or, even better, to persuade
the College of Arms that you are entitled to bear Arms regardless of whether they
are yours or not.
As an example, the family of Carew of Ballinamona Park, which claim arms ( good
enough for Burke's Landed Gentry of Ireland, the 1958 edition), as "Arms-Or,
three lions passant in pale sa., a crescent for difference. Crest-An heraldic
antelope passant sa., crined and horned or, a cresent for difference. Motto-Nil
admirari"
Now this is all in Burke, and it looks all very official, and it is. Problems
come when one looks at the claimed lineage, which begins: "Otho, son of a Duke of
Tuscany, was father of Walter fitzOtho, of Windsor, who was a tenant in chief in
1086 of lands in Berks., Bucks., Middx. and hants. at the time of the Domesday
Survey (see Burke's Peerage, Leinster, D), m Gwladys, dau of Rywallon, Prince of
South Wales, his son Gerald Fitzwalter Castellan of Pembroke m 1108 Nesta heiress
of Carew Castel nr Tenby From this line descended in direct lin etc etc etc."
Er, no, as a matter of fact. The later parts of this are okay, but as for Otho, a
Duke of Tuscany, his real name was Other, and Walter Fitzotho was really Walter
FitzOther. As for the Duke of Tuscany bit, that is part of a story of
genealogical fabrication that goes back to the Middle ages. Despite that great
antiquity, it's still a story of genealogical fabrication. See
http://www.jbending.demon.co.uk/ancestor.htm
So the real point about the codswallop about who can and who can't use a coat of
arms in this case is that the Fitzgeralds have been able to persuade the powers
that be to accept a fictitious background. And in doing so they demonstrate to
all and sundry that they are above the law or that they can use the law rather
than be used by it
So the material below is the theory that ordinary mortals are supposed to
subscribe to. But as Burkes themselves put it, “Burke’s Peerage”, Oscar Wilde
once said, “it is the best thing the English
have done in fiction.” Don't take it all too seriously!
Charlie

wrote:

> The following came from the Lord Lyon's web site a couple of days ago.
> Armorial bearings, being for distinguishing persons of, and within, a
> family, cannot descend to, or be used by, persons who are not members of the
> family. The surname indicates the family to which a family belongs. A person
> named Macdonald cannot bear a Ross coat of arms, or any part of it. The
> Chief's coat of arms fulfils within the clan or family the same purpose as
> the Royal Arms do in a Kingdom. There is no such thing as a "family crest" or
> "family coat of arms" which anyone can assume, or a whole family can use.
> Armorial bearings, of which the Crest is a subsidiary part, are a form of
> individual heritage property, devolving upon one person at a time by
> sucession from the grantee or confirmee, and thus descend like a Peerage.
> They indicate the Chief of the Family or Clan, or the Head of each subsidiary
> line or household descending from members who have themselves established in
> the Public Register of All Arms and Bearings in Scotland a right to a
> subsidiary version of the arms and crest, containing a mark of difference
> indicating their position in the Family or Clan. This is not a "new" coat of
> arms, it is the ancient ancestral arms with a mark of cadency, usefully
> showing the cadet's place within the family. It identifies where you, and
> your own heirs, belong within the family. It is, as well as being beautiful,
> a valuable system of identification. The parts of the armorial bearings
> consist of: * The Shield, bearing the basic device * The Helmet, with its
> Crest, which sits on top of the helmet * The Motto in a scroll * The Mantling
> or cape, which kept the sun off the wearer's armour in hot weather * Very
> rarely, two Supporters on either side of the shield, which are external
> attributes of the arms of Peers, Chiefs and a very few other persons of
> special importance, including Knights Grand Cross of Orders. It is illegal to
> assume and purport to use your Chief's arms without a due and congruent
> recorded difference. Anyone who does so merely publishes their own ignorance.
> There is no such thing as a "Clan coat of arms". The arms are those of the
> Chief, and clansmen have only the privilege of wearing the strap-and-buckle
> crested badge to show they are such Chief's clansmen. One cannot have a crest
> without first having a shield of arms, because the crest was a later
> addition. Misuse of crests arises from misunderstanding of the badge rule
> under which junior members of the family may wear in specified manner their
> Chief's crest as badge. Crest Badge The Crest of the Chief is worn by all
> members of the Clan and of approved Septs and followers of the Clan, within a
> strap and buckle surround bearing the Chief's motto. This is for personal
> wear only, to indicate that the wearer is a member of the Clan whose Chief's
> crest-badge is being worn. The badge or crest is not depicted on personal or
> business stationery, signet rings or plate, because such use would legally
> import that the tea-pot, etc., was the Chief's property! Acquisition of
> Grants and Matriculations of Arms Those who wish to use arms in any
> particular sense must petition for a Grant of Arms or -- if they can trace
> their ancestry back to a direct or, in some cases collateral, ancestor -- a
> "cadet matriculation" showing their place with the family. Forms of Petition
> and sample proof-sheets relative to such application can be supplied if
> required. When a grant, or matriculation, of arms is successfully obtained,
> an illuminated parchment, narrating the pedigree as proved, is supplied to
> the Petitioner, and a duplicate is recorded in the Public Register of All
> Arms and Bearings in Scotland and/or the Public Register of Genealogies and
> Birthbrieves. Application for such a Confirmation, by Letters Patent or
> Matriculation, from the Lord Lyon King of Arms is the only way to obtain a
> genuine coat of arms. Tartans People normally wear only the tartan (if any)
> of their surname, or a "district tartan" connected with their residence or
> family's place of origin. Check out our Tartans page for more information.
> Note: This information was taken from a leaflet published by the Court of the
> Lord Lyon, HM New Register House, Edinburgh, EH1 3YT. "


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