GENBOX-L Archives

Archiver > GENBOX > 2003-06 > 1054577771


From: "Cheri Casper" <>
Subject: RE: [GENBOX] Nuances of Places
Date: Mon, 2 Jun 2003 11:16:30 -0700
In-Reply-To: <FFEBLNNBNENFDKOPJEBPOEGADKAA.paulharris@nc.rr.com>


Paul - No, it doesn't help. I do create a new entry on the next available
blank line. It is just that when it comes to the higher place level, it is
auto-filled with the same higher place level as the standard name and no
amount of futzing lets me change that. Sometimes I am succesful if I create
a totally new place with just city & state and then merge, but trying to
edit an existing place and add name variants is next to impossible.

C

-----Original Message-----
From: Paul J. Harris [mailto:]
Sent: Monday, June 02, 2003 9:23 AM
To:
Subject: RE: [GENBOX] Nuances of Places


Cheri,

Okay, but as Wim queried, let me make sure of where you are entering the
Name Variation. When you go to the Name Tab for Merriam (City/Town), if you
have no name variations, then ONLY the Standard Name will be seen at the top
of the list window on this tab. Perhaps you have more, by now, but assuming
there is only one entry in the list, it will say "Merriam" and then in the
Higher Place field below the list it says "Johnson Co., Kansas, United
States."

When you go to enter the Name Variation, are you starting in a blank entry,
just below "Merriam" in the list window, or are you starting in the Higher
Place box? To create a Name Variation it is necessary to retype "Merriam" in
the empty row, just below the Standard Name entry of Merriam in the list
window. Just for clarification, is this what you are doing?

Once you have two "Merriam"s in the list window, you can change the text in
the Higher Place box and this new Higher Place definition will be associated
with the selected entry in the list window. Once you have two "Merriam"s in
the list window, clicking on each one will change the content of the Higher
Place box to reflect the differences. IOW, clicking on the Standard (first)
Merriam will put Johnson Co., Kansas, United States in the Higher Place box.
Clicking on the second Merriam will put Kansas, United States in the Higher
Place box.

Does any of this help?

Paul

-----Original Message-----
From: Cheri Casper [mailto:]
Sent: Monday, June 02, 2003 11:45 AM
To:
Subject: RE: [GENBOX] Nuances of Places


Paul - Your analysis was correct BUT even after selecting the Johnson Co.,
Kansas and overtyping with just Kansas, when all was said & done, and the
typing completed, Johnson Co. had insinuated its way back into the mix. The
overtyping thing has *never* worked for me. Deleting and retyping without
the county doesn't seem to work either. Therein lies the problem. If it
were easy for me to make a name variant, it wouldn't be a problem, but no
matter what I do to try to get omitted place levels, they always appear once
the typing has stopped.

CheriC


-----Original Message-----
From: Paul J. Harris [mailto:]
Sent: Monday, June 02, 2003 5:14 AM
To:
Subject: RE: [GENBOX] Nuances of Places


Hi Cheri,

I understand your frustration, but RIGHT NOW, the closest thing you can
achieve to separate "fields" for place levels is separating commas to
"designate the right field."

Now, to your example. You said you were in the Place View with the "Merriam"
(City/Town) General Tab in view. In the Higher Place field it had "Johnson
Co., Kansas." Correct, so far? Now, you sleeted the Names Tab and went to a
blank line below the list of names and re-entered "Merriam." However, the
Higher Place field is still populated by "Johnson Co., Kansas." Am I still
correct? At this point, select all of the text in the Higher Place field and
delete it or simply start typing K-a-n-s-a-s. At some point, doesn't it
auto-fill with Kansas, United States? You have just created the alternative
name you are looking for.

Is this of any help?

Paul

-----Original Message-----
From: Cheri Casper [mailto:]
Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2003 11:41 PM
To:
Subject: RE: [GENBOX] Nuances of Places


Paul - This is what I was trying to do to create the place in the first
place. Open up the Places. Find Merriam, Johnson Co., Kansas. Then go to
the Names tab for Merriam and try to make a name variant of Merriam, Kansas.
GB kept sticking the "Johnson Co." in there no matter how much I tried to
keep it out of the variant.

I do not have commas for missing places turned on, nor do I want to. I
don't to have to remember how many missing place levels I have. I have not
ever in my genealogy experience had to do this and I don't want to have to
figure this out at this late juncture. And I don't want to have to type in
a bunch of commas as I enter date and do the "mental math" to figure out how
many I need.

I am about to the point where I don't give a d**n about what GB does with
places behind the scenes. If I end up with 15 separate places that are
Merriam, Kansas or variations thereof, what is the difference. The bottom
line for me it output.

I still think it would be a WHOLE lot easier if each place level had its own
separate field for data entry when adding an Event. No guesswork, no
extraneous commas, whatever required.

CheriC

-----Original Message-----
From: Paul J. Harris [mailto:]
Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2003 7:16 PM
To:
Subject: RE: [GENBOX] Nuances of Places


Hi Cheri,

Given the setup you have below, I see at least two ways to get to the proper
combination of linked places (name):

1. As you type "Merriam" into the Place field of an Event, you probably get
an auto-completion by GB that includes the county. As long as the other Name
variation exists, continue typing the EXACT format of the other variation
until IT auto-completes. IOW, after "Merriam" add a comma-space-comma (to
represent the empty Township field), THEN space-comma (to represent the
'empty' County field in the other name variation that you want), THEN
space-K-a-n-s-a-s. At some point it should auto-complete to the variation
you are looking for.

2. Another, perhaps easier and less confusing, option is to start with an
empty Place field and double click to bring up the Place Search View. Start
typing "Merriam" and it will filter down to matching variations showing the
higher place links (very helpful):

Merriam, , Johnson Co., Kansas
Merriam, , , Kansas

Now select the one you want to return to the Event View. No muss, no fuss.
You see ahead of time exactly what you are getting.

Do you have "Show commas for missing levels" turned on in Preferences/Names?
If not, that may "help" you see the structure of place relationships in the
data fields.

Hope this helps,

Paul


-----Original Message-----
From: Cheri Casper [mailto:]
Sent: Friday, May 30, 2003 9:54 PM
To:
Subject: [GENBOX] Nuances of Places


What I STILL don't get is how to make a place appear absent the county.

I have this:

City/Town = Merriam
Higher Place = Johnson Co., Kansas

There is a name variant for the place that is Merriam, Kansas (without the
Johnson County).

When I add a new Local Site, I want it to just be Shawnee Mission Rural High
School, Merriam, Kansas. The county creeps in no matter what I do. This is
the part that perpetually perplexes me. Even though there is a name variant
without the county name for the city/town, why can't I create a Local Site
attached to that city/town that doesn't have the county thrown in. I don't
get it, I don't get it, I don't get it. Nor do I want to have to make a
name variant for the school that I will never use.

For the most part, I would just prefer that counties go away all together
although I do like them attached to the city/town for reference purposes.
But for display and reports, NO. That is another reason why I would prefer
a separate field for each part of a place level. If I omitted the county
name, I would expect the name to NOT display the omitted level.
Alternatively, the ability to add any place level at the Event level and
suppress it from EVER PRINTING.

Sheesh. Why is this so difficult?

CheriC



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==== GENBOX Mailing List ====
To join this list, send an email to with the
word "subscribe" as the subject line. Then email your messages to
and they will appear on this list.

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to:
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==== GENBOX Mailing List ====
To join this list, send an email to with the
word "subscribe" as the subject line. Then email your messages to
and they will appear on this list.

==============================
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to:
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==== GENBOX Mailing List ====
To join this list, send an email to with the
word "subscribe" as the subject line. Then email your messages to
and they will appear on this list.

==============================
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to:
http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=571&sourceid=1237


==== GENBOX Mailing List ====
To join this list, send an email to with the
word "subscribe" as the subject line. Then email your messages to
and they will appear on this list.

==============================
To join Ancestry.com and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy records, go
to:
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