DNA-R1B1C7-L Archives

Archiver > DNA-R1B1C7 > 2011-08 > 1314503275

Subject: Re: [R-M222] DNA-R1B1C7 Digest, Vol 5, Issue 284
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2011 23:47:55 -0400 (EDT)

In a message dated 8/27/2011 8:10:47 P.M. Central Daylight Time,

Such a
beginning is found in the old Irish annals and the old writ, Ceart Ui
out of Donegal, Ireland. The MacTavishes come from the Cenel nDuach a
of the Cenel Conaill, descended from the Pictish Kings of Ros Guill and
Irguill, now part of Donegal, and also from Dal-araidhe, now part of Antrim
and Down. The Greek (Roman)historian, mapmaker and mathmetician, Ptolemy,
mentions the tribe under the name of Ouenniknoi (Windukatii), and the
lineage is tracable in such texts as the Irish Annuls of Ulster and Four

This writer seems to be combining Lacey's Cruithin origin for the Cenel
Conaill with his own guesses at the origin of his Scottish surname.

The Ceart Ui Neill, the Rights of O'Neill mentions a sub-chieftain of the
O'Donnells as Mac Giolla Shamhais
from Ros Buill. The same name also appears in the Topographical Poems.

To MacGillatsamhais the stout,
Belong Ros-Guill2 and Ros-Iorguil,I reckon;

O'Donovan's notes:

210. Gillatsamhais.-This name is now either unknown or lurks under some
anglicised form. The most analogical anglicised form of it would be

The line is only traceable if you assume they are indeed descended from the
Cenel Duach of Donegal. The pedigree of the Cenel Duach can be found
in the Rawlinson B.502 genealogies and is as presented by the writer except
for the inclusion of Fergus Cennfoda (or maybe that's something he took
from Lacey or an entry in the Annals of Ulster in 586). Of course each name
in the pedigree is a prince - one even married a daughter of King Loarn of
Scotland. They held some early importance within the Cenel Conaill. One
was King of Tara in the late 500s.

At any rate it seems to be a classic example of someone latching onto an
Irish surname in early records and assuming that is the origin of their own
surname centuries later in another country.


This thread: