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Archiver > DNA-R1B1C7 > 2010-08 > 1282726419

From: David Ewing <>
Subject: Re: [R-M222] change in Haplogroup numbering
Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2010 02:53:39 -0600

Richard Murray speaks about the bewildering changes in nomenclature for
R:M222, and it feels to him like with each change he is being given a new

Here is a metaphor I hope will help. Consider that R:M222 is a leaf on a
great big tree that was once "named" R1b1c7, but that is really more like
directions for finding the leaf than a name. You go down the R branch, take
the 1 branch, then the b branch off that, then the 1 branch off that 1 (a
different 1)...etc. As time has gone along, lots of new leaves and branches
of the tree have been discovered. R:M222 is the same old leaf it ever was
and it is in the same place it ever was, but now the directions for finding
it in the tree are more complicated because we have found so many new
branches upstream.

You can see this graphically if you go to the haplotree posted on the ISOGG
website at
"Our" branch is shown there as *R1b1b2a1a2f2* M222/USP9Y+3636, and is six
up from the bottom. Think about what will have to happen to the nomenclature
if a new branch (that is, a new SNP) is discovered somewhere upstream. Every
address downstream from the new branch will have to be reworked to take the
location of the new branch into account. If you are ready to really see what
is happening, look at older versions of the tree and compare them with this
more recent one. You can find links to two older versions of the tree (from
2005 and 2008) at

David Ewing

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