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Archiver > DNA-R1B1C7 > 2009-04 > 1240411909


From: "Sandy Paterson" <>
Subject: Re: [R-M222] Byrne TMRCA Estimates
Date: Wed, 22 Apr 2009 15:51:49 +0100
References: <e0d2d2870904220656j47c48ac1j46080310e699f62b@mail.gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <e0d2d2870904220656j47c48ac1j46080310e699f62b@mail.gmail.com>


Hi David

>
Still, I think this line of inquiry is more likely to be productive if it is
restricted to surname modals.
>

Most of the random noise counts little towards the computed numbers, but
that's not obvious from my postings. I really need to get going on a website
so that I can set out example calculations. Where it does affect the answers
is for example with the Ewing values of DYS391=10. However, although Ewing
is modal at DYS391=11, the presence of DYS391=10 in significant quantity
suggests to me that we can't be sure whether the Ewing group started with 10
or 11 at that marker. So I'm more comfortable using individual haplotypes.


Sandy


-----Original Message-----
From:
[mailto:] On Behalf Of David Ewing
Sent: 22 April 2009 14:57
To:
Subject: Re: [R-M222] Byrne TMRCA Estimates

Sandy's arguments for not neglecting the more rapidly moving markers are
well taken. Except, as he says, possibly CDY.

Still, I think this line of inquiry is more likely to be productive if it is
restricted to surname modals. The clade structure we are looking for
probably existed before surnames achieved their (relatively) modern form, so
mutations that have occurred since surnames were in use will just amount to
noise. By using surname modals, we will be able to filter that noise out. To
be sure, as Sandy points out, we will lose some of the variance in the
entire body of data, but this is exactly the variance that just adds to our
confusion.

Incidentally, the discussion on this list of Ewing haplotypes is restricted
to those Ewings who are participating in the M222 project and/or those in
YSearch. Our project now has a total of 109 Ewing haplotypes (of which I
think only 5 have fewer than 37 markers). I am happy to make all of this
data available to anyone that is interested, but I don't think it would
serve much purpose--those Ewings in the M222 project are a fairly
representative sample and the modals are the same.

David
R1b1c7 Research and Links:

http://clanmaclochlainn.com/R1b1c7/
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