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Archiver > DNA-R1B1C7 > 2007-12 > 1196510867


From: Daniel Jenkins <>
Subject: Re: [DNA-R1B1C7] What's the connection here?
Date: Sat, 1 Dec 2007 12:07:47 +0000
References: <d19.1801ef14.34828019@aol.com>
In-Reply-To: <d19.1801ef14.34828019@aol.com>


John,

It is interesting that you mention Gallagher CDJ57. This is Sean Robert Gallagher , who is a close match with my Uncle Dan Gallagher of Derry and Tasmania [long story], and also with DPUSJ Hugh Golliher of Tenn. I have researched all 3 .
Curiously after waiting 2 years the match with Sean popped up and he lives a quarter mile away from me .
I have verified his family to early 1800s to Quigleys Point and Iskaheen Parish in Inishowen .
As you know Eoghan son of Niall is buried at Iskaheen Cemetery .
The parish priest is very helpful and he has all the church records in a file on computer. He printed out the Gallaghers for me .
I can find his e-mail if you wish .
Seans' ancestor was a Daniel at Three Trees, Quigleys Point ,
My ancestor was Patrick at Derry 1810 who likely descended from same family as Seans
up and accross the Foyle a short way .
Hugh Golliher/Gallagher looks to be from a townland about 12 miles southeast of Derry on the Derry side of the Foyle closeby to Donegal .
The Doghertys and Gallaghers of Ballyshannon and Strabane intermarried several times .
William Doherty and Jane Gallagher are recorde in parishes in Strabane and
these same families are intertwined with the Fergusons at Ballyshannon .
Ferguson researchers believe that they derive from Plantation Scots early 1600s .
I agree somewhat but think the line goes back to Ulster Irish in Scotland long before and these Ulster Irish have roots in Viking Dublin .
There was a minor King or Chief Ferghus at Dublin before 500ad .

My interest in Fergusons is thus . My cousin Allis Edelman was born a Ferguson , granddaughter of Charles Ferguson an English /Irish soldier at Ballyshannon .
In 1804 after serving more than 20 years , he became a magistrate at Ballyshannon and Manor Hamilton . Her maternal line goes back to my ancestor Samuel Jenkins 1710-1804 , at Scituate great grandson of my ancestor Edward Jenkins of Bethersden , Kent , England from a family there since 1400s.
My Jenkins R1a1* DNA is probably from ancient Kurgans while DNA on maternal side is R1b with the paternal Gallagher DNA being the R1b1c7.

During research I have found many connections bewtween the McLoughlan, and all variants with all the above , but of course before 1600s , things get really murkey .

I have a hugh amount of data , [dates , names , etc,] but fine details are not that important to the thoughts .

If you draw a box including NW , N Ireland and Western and Lowland Scotland , Lancashire , England , I believe you are talking about people with a great deal of commonality in ancient ancestors .
Too bad we couldn't lower the ocean to search all the lost evidence on the once vast plain that connected all .


Between marriages , NPEs , and clan name association before surname adoption , everything is quite difficult to sort out.

Dan J.


> From: > Date: Sat, 1 Dec 2007 04:15:05 -0500> To: > Subject: [DNA-R1B1C7] What's the connection here?> > In David Wilson's R1b1c7 project of 213 samples (from a few months ago) > there is a group of 18 who share an identical value at DYS 447 (24). To this > sample set I took the liberty of adding an additional 18 samples that are not in > the R1b1c7 project (17 McLaughlins and one Bennett).> > The surnames and numbers are as follows:> > McLaughlin (19)> Doherty (10)> Ferguson (1)> Slotnick (1)> Kelley (1)> Neel (1)> Burns (1)> Wilson (1)> Bennet (1)> > Two of these surnames are known NPEs (Slotnick, Bennett).> > The modal for this group differs from the overall R1b1c7 modal at the > following markers:> > DYS 458 = 18> DYS 447 = 24> DYS 576 = 17> CDYb = 38> > Is there anything these surnames have in common (omitting the known NPEs)?> > McLaughlin (19)> Doherty (10)> Ferguson (1)> Kelley (1)> Neel (1)> Burns (1)> Wilson (1)> > The one thing that jumps out from this list of surnames is Doherty and > McLaughlin. Both lived in the same part of Donegal (Inishowen peninsula) for over > 600 years. Both are said to be descendants of Nial from two different sons > (Conal gulban and Eoghan). > > What about the other names?> > Neel is an interesting surname in that the McLaughlins and O'Neills were by > pedigree close relatives. And even though the largest group of O'Neills in > Ulster are not R1b1c7 there are R1b1c7 O'Neills in Ulster in lesser numbers in > the Trinity database. Kelley is a name found everywhere in Ireland, > including Ulster. There was an O Ceallaigh (O'Kelly) sept of the Cenel Maoin of > Magh Ith in Donegal/Tyrone. Like the McLaughlins and O'Neills they would have > been Cenel Eoghain. There were a handful of Byrnes in Donegal in the 1665 > Hearth Money rolls. The surnames Ferguson and Wilson are unknown quantities.> > I did the following search in Ysearch to see if any matches were to be found > outside of the R1b1c7 project. I took the first 12 markers of the R1b1c7 > modal and added DYS 458 = 18; DYS 447 = 24; and DYS 576 = 17. These are the > markers where this particular group differ from the overall R1b1c7 modal. > Parameters, 15 markers, 0 genetic distance. I omitted CDYb since it's such a > flaky marker.> > Results:> > 2BZVG McGlothlen Donegal, Ireland R1b1c7 (tested) > 9F7N8 McLaughlin Possibly Letterkenny or environs, Donegal, Ireland R1b* > EX7BV Doherty Ireland Unknown Family Tree DNA > Q7KMX Show McGlothlin Isle of Man, Scotland > vw4hb Show McLaughlin Inis Eonáin (preliminary), Ireland R1b1c7 (tested) > > All Dohertys and McLaughlins.> > I find this too significant in terms of the shared history and location of > the Dohertys and McLaughlins to be mere coincidence. In addition to these two > families, a few other samples on Ysearch have the exact same DNA pattern.> > > CDJ57 Gallagher Donegal (County), Ireland > YKCHB Donnelly Ireland> SMGF Donnelly Ireland> BMW3B Donnelly Bellaghy, Ireland> NM4WF Conlon Westmeath> VHHAF O'Boyle unknown> 5SQMG Neill Ireland> GE8QH Neill unknown> 2WEAD Neel Ulster> EJA9K Kennedy Ireland> SMGF Kennedy Ireland> SMGF Granahan Donegal Surname> NK7RK Devenny > > The Gallaghers were, like the Dohertys, from Donegal. The Donnellys were > like the McLaughlins and O'Neills, Cenel Eoghain. So were the Devennys from > Donegal. The O'Boyles were from Donegal. Granahan is a common Donegal > surname. Conlan may be southern Ui Neill (from Westmeath). We have a few more > Neill/Neels to add to the mix.> > If you do a different search in Ysearch with the first 12 R1b1c7 markers > plus DYS 447 = 24 (0 genetic distance) you get 24 matches out of the close to > 1000 NW Irish DNA matches.> > P772N "Foster" St. Martins, New Brunswick, Canada R1b1c7 (tested) Family > Tree DNA 13 0> XF6U7 Towne Great Yarmouth, England Unknown Family Tree DNA 13 0> vw4hb Show McLaughlin Inis Eonáin (preliminary), Ireland R1b1c7 (tested) > Family Tree DNA 13 0> YKCHB Donley Ireland R1b (tested) Family Tree DNA 13 0> P853Z McLaughlin Ireland Unknown Family Tree DNA 13 0> PKJH4 Doherty Clougherna, Ardagh, Clonmany Parish, Co. Donegal, Ireland > R1b1 (tested) Family Tree DNA 13 0> C7N4C Show English "Niall of the Nine Hostages", Ireland R1b1 (tested) > Family Tree DNA 13 0> CDJ57 Gallagher Donegal (County), Ireland R1b1 (tested) Family Tree DNA > 13 0> 4944Z Grady Roscrea, Ireland Unknown Family Tree DNA 13 0> EJA9K kennedy Ireland R1b (tested) Family Tree DNA 13 0> EX7BV Doherty Ireland Unknown Family Tree DNA 13 0> 2BZVG McGlothlen Donegal, Ireland R1b1c7 (tested) Family Tree DNA 13 0> 9F7N8 McLaughlin Possibly Letterkenny or environs, Donegal, Ireland R1b* > Family Tree DNA 13 0> UTK7U Dougherty Donegal, Ireland R1b1c7 (tested) Family Tree DNA 13 0> VYD3F McLaughlin Donegal, Ireland R1b1c7* Other - smgf.org 13 0> MP2PE McLaughlin Family Modal, 37/6=217,25/3=114,, Ulster, Ireland > Unknown Family Tree DNA 13 0> Q7KMX Show McGlothlin Isle of Man, Scotland Unknown Family Tree DNA 13 0> GTDGC McLaughlin Scotland R1b1 (tested) Family Tree DNA 13 0> XQVDF McDaniel Bedford, Pennsylvania, USA R1b (tested) Family Tree DNA > 13 0> 6FDG7 Moore South Carolina, USA Unknown Family Tree DNA 13 0> VVKQ7 McCally Virginia, USA R1b* Family Tree DNA 13 0> EAU62 Soakell Unknown Unknown Family Tree DNA 13 0> J8Y2R Montgomery Unknown Unknown Family Tree DNA 13 0> W9TPC Bennett (Adopted) Unknown R1b (tested) Family Tree DNA 13 0> > Now we have two more known NPEs (Foster, known surname change; Soakal). > Still mostly McLaughlins and Dohertys with a few other surnames thrown in. > Few if any from England or Scotland. Mostly in Ireland. > > Any comments or suggestions as to what this might mean? Maybe it doesn't > mean anything at all. But I cannot help but suspect that this > Doherty/McLaughin connection means something. Some of the other matches could be random > mutations or convergence.> > > > John> > > > > **************************************Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest > products.> (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001)>; > > -------------------------------> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message
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