DNA-R1B1C7-L Archives

Archiver > DNA-R1B1C7 > 2007-08 > 1186753596


From: "Paul Conroy" <>
Subject: Re: [DNA-R1B1C7] Network.exe
Date: Fri, 10 Aug 2007 09:46:36 -0400
References: <d67.10717d49.33ed2fa2@aol.com>
In-Reply-To: <d67.10717d49.33ed2fa2@aol.com>


John,

Fascinating stuff!!!

I'm not qualified to respond on the methodology you use, I hope David Ewing
or David Wilson sound off?!

Can you provide the URL to the latest version of the Network software - I'd
love to attempt to analyze some data myself?

BTW, does anyone out there use Cluster software, and if so can they provide
URL or a how-to on its use - TIA.

Cheers,
Paul


On 8/10/07, <> wrote:
>
> I think I might have just answered my own question on the figures to use
> in
> Network.exe time calculations.
>
> "0.00069 per locus per 25 years (Zhivotovsky et al. 2004). ..."
>
> If you multiply .00069 X 17 (17 markers) you get .01173
>
> 1 divided by .01173 = 85.25
>
> 85.25 X 25 years = 2131 years
>
> or
>
> 1 mutation every 2131 years
>
> Which is the number Trinity College used in its Network
> TMRCA calculations.
>
> You can do the same thing for 25 and 37 markers.
>
> 25 markers
>
> .01725 (25 markers) 25 years
>
> 57.97 X 25 = 1449 years
>
> 1 mutation every 1449 years
>
>
> 37 markers
>
> .0255 (37 markers) 25 years
>
> 39.2 X 25 = 980 years
>
> 1 mutation every 980 years
>
>
> I then had Network.exe calculate the TMRCA using a 25 marker dataset of
> equal numbers of McLaughlins and Ewings, using the standard NW Irish modal
> as an
> ancestral node and chosing every McLaughin and Ewing node as descendant,
> regardless of how distant they were from the others of the same surname.
>
> Results:
>
> McLaughin vs. Ewing results
> 25 markers
>
> 4398.75 years (SD 1536) SD 3042 to 5934
>
> 2391 BC. (or SD 1035 BC to 3927 BC)
>
> A TMRCA of 4398 years with a standard deviance of 1536 years.
>
> The basic TMRCA would translate to 2391 BC.
>
> The standard deviance would give a range of 1035 BC to 3927 BC).
>
>
> Can anyone poke some holes in this methodology? Is there something
> besides the standard NW irish modal I should be using for an
> ancestral node? Or
> something else I've done wrong? It seems pretty clear this is the method
> Trinity College used in analyzing their own 17 marker dataset of Ui Neill
> surnames
> in NW Ireland in arriving at their 1730 year figure TMRCA.
>
> These figures for TMRCA are not far off John McEwen's own projections
> for
> R1bSTR19. If they hold water then the M222+ mutation occurred far before
> the
> time of Nial (d. 405-450 AD).
>
> If any one would like to try this in Network.exe I'd
> recommend downloading
> the latest version. For some reason an older version kept blowing up
> when I
> tried extended marker datasets. The latest version works just fine on 25
> markers. Haven't tried 37 yet.
>
>
> John
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL
> at
> http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
>
> -------------------------------
> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to
> with the word 'unsubscribe' without the
> quotes in the subject and the body of the message
>

This thread: