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Archiver > DNA-R1B1C7 > 2007-06 > 1180835529


From:
Subject: Re: [DNA-R1B1C7] R1b1c7 in England
Date: Sat, 2 Jun 2007 21:52:09 EDT


Here are a few more possible R1b1c7 matches from Ysearch.

Italy

NPN3E La Susa Miselmeri, Italy
YQFZW Bernardoni Italy
SGMF Martino Italy

13 25 14 11 11 14 12 12 11 13 14 29
13 24 14 11 12 13 12 12 12 13 14 29
13 26 14 11 11 13 12 12 12 13 14 29

Are these NW Irish? Or just similar DNA? The last one in particular
(Martino) on Sorenson has the characteristic 18-30 (DYS 448, 449) and 15-16-16-17
of the NW Irish modal. Bernardoni in Italy matches a Haggerty on Ysearch
(NYNXC) exactly at 12 markers. And Haggerty is an Irish surname closely
associated with Donegal. La Susa from Italy pulls up 12 marker matches with Le
Compte in France (3A5MS) and Urquhart (UR8YY) in Scotland. The Le Compte sample
on Ysearch is 25 markers and contains some extremely off modal values for a
NW Irish specimen.

13 25 14 11 11 14 12 12 11 13 14 29 17 9 9 11 11 25 14 18 30 15 15 16 16

I don't know myself. Just throwing some of these out to see what others
think. How do you draw the line in identifying possible R1b1c7s based on STRs
alone?

I haven't updated this list in some time but a list of M222+ would appear to
show that almost any value can appear at key NW Irish markers.

_http://members.aol.com/lochlan/m222.htm_
(http://members.aol.com/lochlan/m222.htm)

DYS 390 = 24-26
DYS 385a = 11 (not on the list but my own DNA and others shows 12).
DYS 385b = 13-14
DYS 392 = 13-15
DYS 389-2 = 29-31
DYS 448 = 18
DYS 449 = 28-32
DYS 464a = 14-16
DYS 464b = 15-16
DYS 464c = 16-17
DYS 464d = 16-17

One M222+ sample is nearly unrecognizable as NW Irish (Larkin, YS9J6 on
Ysearch). He misses the modal at almost every key marker except for DYS 392 = 14.




John



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